Bugs Bunny war time cartoons not fair?

[jnbmoore]

Growing up i loved the ooooold Bugs Bunnies. I especially like the WWII Bugs Bunnies cause it gave interesting insight to the homefront war (Strange kid that I was, I liked history)

Cartoon Network is having a special next week about the "cruel" portrayals of the Axis armies and leaders in Bugs Bunny Cartoons.

http://www.nypost.com/entertainment/33292.htm

I guess in war time we need to do more to love our enemies







Bridgette

[poseidon]

Ummmmmmmm they're cartoons.

Not only that, but until recently (the last few decades) Bugs Bunny was not a cartoon aimed at children. These cartoons were meant to be shown prior to the "feature presentation" in the theaters.

Moreover, my understanding is that many of these wartime cartoons were used for propaganda and morale-boosting services. The cartoonists took the effort to show their patriotism.

So, for someone to say that these cartoons unfairly depict the Axis powers (I remember Bugs Bunny doing the Japanese thing, but I don't remember Germany or Italy being done) is a bit unfair on the surface because they're obviously not taking into account the timeline in which these were produced and shown.

Jeff
who hasn't taken the time to read the article yet.

[jnbmoore]

I vaguely remember a Hitler one. Bugs dressed up as Hitler to give a commander some strange orders......


Bridgette

[erik_kosberg]

Any unfair depiction the Axis powers type of complaint would be more than a little ludicrous; we were after all involved in total war where fairness counts for little. But showing the old Bugs movies without some type of commentary would also be more than a little ludicrous. Some of them (particularly the ones about Japan) were overtly racist. Bugs wasn’t alone, even Dr. Seuss did some overtly racist artwork during the war. Show the work (it is after all a part of our history) but explain the context.

[jnbmoore]

But showing the old Bugs movies without some type of commentary would also be more than a little ludicrous

Okay , I guess this is the silly part to me. I see those cartoons and I know that it's WWII and the events surrounding the war and realize it's propoganda.

Kinda sad to me that we have to give basic history lessons all the time........

Of course, is history even taught in schools anymore?

Bridgette
who never got beyond 1942 in any history class. Who won the war anyhow?

[erik_kosberg]

Sure, some history is taught in schools, but not very well. Since Stephen Ambrose is a “Famous Historian” his dreadful book will probably be widely used to teach the history of WW2.

I think that some commentary is needed for the Bugs cartoons just because so many people know so little about history. But inaccurate commentary would be as bad as no commentary.

[wivabef]

I though cartoons were the one last place we could say what we were really thinking and get away with it.

For some current UN PC stereotypes, see the Simpsons for Abu the far eastern convenience store worker. Or the springfield cops en masse at a donut shop.

God forbid we insult Hitler!

[mtbat]

Okay, I can't get the story in question to load right now but-What I do know is that-

The cartoons that poked fun at the enemy during WWII were made as propoganda. They were used to help the american people support the war efforts. The enemy was to be made fun of and ridiculed because it made us feel better as a nation-I'm sure that the Germans and the Japanize had simaler programs. But I don't hear anyone talking about that.

But more importantly they gave the familys of the men who were out there dying for their country something to laugh about-no easy task when your son, brother or father might be dying in a ditch somewhere.

Perhaps any "comentary" about these cartoons should include a bit of information on the Stalags in Germany and the Batan Death March.

We have come a long way. We have as a nation appologized for the internment camps, we have appologized for a lot of things that were "wrong".

In a historical context there is absolutly nothing wrong with those old cartoons-and there is no reason why they shouldn't be seen.

Okay-I'm going to try AGAIN to load that page-

Fridai

[mtbat]

okay, I got the story to load and it's probably a very good thing I don't have cable TV, otherwise I'd watch the show and get even 'er.

I'm sure the producers of this show never concidered putting anything about the cruelty of the Japanize into the show-

I'm sorry, but my grandfather missed dying in the pacific by about an hour and my 2ed cousin spent 4 years in a Japanize internment camp as a child. So I am well aware of the cruelties on BOTH sides and B*tching about a pretend bunny just irks me.



sorry
Fridai

[erik_kosberg]

Perhaps any "comentary" about these cartoons should include a bit of information on the Stalags in Germany and the Batan Death March.

Sure, and mention other Axis atrocities. Let’s just not forget to mention that the Allies executed the wrong man for complicity in the Bataan Death March. We put Homma Masaharu in front of a firing squad but Tsuji Masanobu deserved the real blame for ordering the killings. Homma was no war criminal, he even condemned members of his own military at the time of the Rape of Nanking, a courageous act that risked his life. The main reason that I think that there should be some kind of commentary to put these Bugs cartoons into a historical context is that American kids are so ignorant of their own history.

[poseidon]

Perhaps any "comentary" about these cartoons should include a bit of information on the Stalags in Germany and the Batan Death March.

I agree.

American kids are so ignorant of their own history.

I agree.

[roymeo]

You know, I've worked a bit with some of the Cartoon Network people (way out on the fringes), and they aren't necessarily making their stuff for the 6 year old boy watching the cartoons.

Their target market is more the 16 to 36 year old watching the cartoons.


Just about 2 years ago, one of the stations ran a whole bunch of those Bugs cartoons and a roommate and I watched them, AMAZED at what they were doing, and AMAZED at all the things that we now caught but missed on all the other times we'd viewed the cartoons.


Bugs and the Gremlin are plummeting to the earth in a plane, screaming, holding each other, etc. Just as they are about to splat on the ground, the plane runs out of gas.

Neat gag, but the really neat part of it is that Bugs makes the comment about "what would you expect on a C ration card". I remember seeing WWII ration tickets that may father has when I was a child, but it really wasn't a funny joke, then. Now, I get it.

If you want your children to be educated by Cartoon Network's airing of these films, you'll have to watch them with them, instead of leaving it up to Cartoon Network to do it all for you, I suppose.


Reminds me of the first Batman serial. It ran in 12 or 14 installments, after Pearl Harbor. The opening scene is a vacated "Little Tokyo" with a voice-over: "Little Tokyo, once a thriving commerce center until our wise government locked up the shifty eyed Japs." Later on, when Batman meets the bad guy (an obvious Caucasian squinting hard enough to look like he's taking a dump, with some skin-paint and false teeth (Jerry Lewis is a better Asian than this one)) he yells "Oh, a dirty, yellow Jap!" before launching into an attack.

Bugs is tame....and even after being exposed to these horrible movies, some of these children will grow up into adults who realize what Ration Cards are, understand that the movie Pearl Harbor left out a lot of stuff, etc.

roymeo

[poseidon]

Bugs is tame....and even after being exposed to these horrible movies, some of these children will grow up into adults who realize what Ration Cards are, understand that the movie Pearl Harbor left out a lot of stuff, etc.

I agree.

[afropuff]

Did anyone see the war cartoons? They aired them on "Toon Heads" on Sunday night (well past the kiddie-hours).

They were tame. You know, a call to buy war bonds, converse materials, etc. For example: a wolf with a short, Hitler-esque mustache being blown to bits (camera panned away and violence was suggested, not shown). It really wasn't anything worth raising a stink about.

[afropuff]

CONSERVE materials!!!!!! Not "converse"! Guess I should stop typing with the cat in my lap.

[roymeo]

Buy Converse!

well, today, Bugs is putting out for a variety of advertising concerns...is it any surpise that he'd be pulling for the government back then?

I hear Bugs'll sell you imposter Nike's made by slave labor, today.

roymeo

[mtbat]

Originally posted by erik_kosberg

Sure, and mention other Axis atrocities. Let’s just not forget to mention that the Allies executed the wrong man for complicity in the Bataan Death March. We put Homma Masaharu in front of a firing squad but Tsuji Masanobu deserved the real blame for ordering the killings. Homma was no war criminal, he even condemned members of his own military at the time of the Rape of Nanking, a courageous act that risked his life. [/url].

I'm sorry Erik-but the slightly less than honorable but humane execution of one less than compleatly innocent man is not comparable to the horrible deaths of those who died on that march. Yes, we did execute the "wrong man" more or less-but he was a member of a government that allowed the horrible, cruel deaths of hundreds of thousands of young men and women because they didn't belive that surender was honorable.

Better to be executed and die a quick and less painful death than to die slowly bit by bit, starved, beaten, raped and even burried alive.

[erik_kosberg]

It’s just that I think that if we’re going to discuss the war, we have to be willing to admit our own errors. And Japan as a nation has a long way to go in this regard. The German government has at least faced up to the evil of its past; the Japanese government continues to whitewash its history.

It was total war, but America shouldn’t forget what it did wrong (for example, failing to bomb the rail lines leading to the Nazi death camps) even if those wrongs pale in comparison to the atrocities committed on the other side. I’m not suggesting that the two are comparable.

[mtbat]

Originally posted by erik_kosberg
It’s just that I think that if we’re going to discuss the war, we have to be willing to admit our own errors. And Japan as a nation has a long way to go in this regard. The German government has at least faced up to the evil of its past; the Japanese government continues to whitewash its history.

It was total war, but America shouldn’t forget what it did wrong (for example, failing to bomb the rail lines leading to the Nazi death camps) even if those wrongs pale in comparison to the atrocities committed on the other side. I’m not suggesting that the two are comparable.

Okay, I agree compleatly-if there is ANY commentary on Bugs Bunnys portrail of the Japanese there should also be commentary on the Japanese and what THEY did during the war. - Reading this tread I've discovered how strongly I really feel about all this-Maybe it's my family history but it really bothers me that a cartoon is being critizied but not the government(japanese-which I finally figured out how to spell sorry)

Fridai

[patach]

Funny you should say that.

Many people treat cartoons with an extreme low respect now, because the assumption that it's all for kids.

When in reality, Bugs Bunny was more than a label for Michael Jordan and his 5 year old. Tex Avery was as sexist and thrilling as ever, and the Flintstones was as controversial as today's Simpsons. When I got news there was actually PROTEST against the showing on Cartoon Network of these war cartoons (surprisingly hardly any of these protesters were Japanese, former Nazis or Italian solders in WW2), I was wondering what really is speaking in America.

BTW, Steven Speilberg does his "propaganda" thing in an episode of Animaniacs, when the warner siblings terrorized Saddam Hussein.

Saddam: STOP IT! YOU ARE EATING KUWAIT!
Wakko: Needs Salt ::burp::

[wivabef]

It’s just that I think that if we’re going to discuss the war, we have to be willing to admit our own errors.

Okay, Erik, but can we still laugh at France?

:p

[erik_kosberg]

Oui

[mtbat]

Originally posted by patach


BTW, Steven Speilberg does his "propaganda" thing in an episode of Animaniacs, when the warner siblings terrorized Saddam Hussein.

Saddam: STOP IT! YOU ARE EATING KUWAIT!
Wakko: Needs Salt ::burp::

Yes, and 50 years from now the American Government will be expected to appologize for the animaniacs unseemly behavior