Countertop options

[conradd]

Hardwood floors went in this week; next is the range, dishwasher, and sink. (Hooray! I'm down there on weekends and have been cooking on a gas grill in the basement and washing dishes in the laundry sink.) So, we're down to a decision on countertops and cabinetry. He has a huge pantry, so the kitchen is fairly compact. We've discussed granite, hardwood, and laminate countertops but I've seen copper countertops and they are beautiful. Any experience with them? If we go with a cobalt blue range, I think copper countertops would be stunning. We can put copper trim on the range hood too (one of the advantages of dating a guy with a full metal shop). I'm just hoping it will look okay with a stainless steel refrigerator and dishwasher. Opinions?

[magenta321]

I'm partial to the granite. I've never seen copper counter tops before. Will they get that green patina? What's the upkeep with them to make them not green?

[theworm[$]]

I've never seen them either, but am intrigued! I would worry about scratching though.

[lynnzop[$]]

I would think they'd be treated to keep that green patina away. Mom and Dad's old kitchen had copper backsplash tiles, and they are coated with a very thin clear plastic (Dad saved them for me, and I started using them to make jewelry ) so they didn't oxidise or get the verdigris (which is toxic...you wouldn't want it near food!)

I think it would look gorgeous with the cobalt blue. I saw something on one of those makeover shows where they used copper tiles for the ceiling, had a copper sink (it was HUGE and gorgeous). It was an unbelievably beautiful kitchen.

[slick4591[$]]

I don't think the stainless would work with copper & blue, but I too am intrigued with the copper countertop.

[lynnzop[$]]

Here's some pictures...pretty pretty stuff. And a link on the HGTV site says that copper is a better killer for ecoli than stainless steel - the germs live for up to 28 hours on ss, but only 4 hours on copper!

More info...there's a couple of pictures in their gallery that show copper with stainless and it looks great.

[drmomentum[$]]

A copper countertop?

Wow, that's awesome!

[brian_igo]

Copper??? Errr....

It looks really cool, and if he can do artesian-level work in his shop that would save you some money. But I'd be really reluctant to use it as a counter top material in a real kitchen.

Copper is a soft metal. It will scratch and dent. It's also an excellent conductor of heat and it will require at least as much maintenance as a granite counter top. It's also hella expensive. Copper is close to its all-time high right now at just under $4 a pound. That's up 25% in the last month and 400% since 2003. (Inventories are at a record low, even over the last five years, so you shouldn't expect the price to come down soon. Info here.) The good news is, this would be one kitchen material that could be turned back into cash when you remodel again.

Because copper is so dense you'll need a lot of it to do a counter top. Even if your bf can do the labor himself you could still be looking at thousands of dollars for the raw materials. And it will likely weigh at least as much as a stone counter, so you'll have to investigate support capacity in your cabinetry and floor joists.

Finally, that's a hell of a lot of orange to put in a kitchen - even in Corvallis. If you do something like copper counter tops, that's going to be the focal point of the kitchen and maybe the house. How do you choose colors around that? Even if money were no object and you were designing a house from scratch this is something I'd want to think all the way through. I'd also be concerned that five years from now it would look like avocado appliances did when the seventies finally died.



Since the floors are in and you know the cabinets you'll be working with, I would go with whatever material looks best with those parts of the kitchen. The right color and pattern of Formica would be better than something in granite that clashed with the rest of the kitchen.

Among the stone surfaces, I'd rank them in this order: Engineered quartz, soapstone, then granite. Quartz is the most durable, is maintenance-free, and is available in an almost limitless color range. Soapstone is very durable (it was probably used for the lab tables in your HS chemistry class), is heat-resistant, and only needs a wipe down with mineral oil once or twice a year. When you do that it looks really nice, but its only available in black hues. Granite is good and it has a wide range of color choices, but it requires resealing and can crack if exposed to heat. It's fallen off in popularity because quartz is the same price.

Corian seems to come down to taste. If there's a color you like it can save you thousands compared to stone, but a lot of the colors look like they're made of melted crayons, as Delia puts it. But if there is a color that works for you and your kitchen, I'd probably go with it over stone or an upgraded Formica.

Wood looks gorgeous but is the highest maintenance and is practically a petri dish for bacteria.

You might want to take a look at some of the newer laminate counters. Delia and I saw one at a builder's model that is seamless - the edges look exactly like a stone or Corian top but it costs much less. Our local supplier has problems with service and getting things right the first time, otherwise it would be very high on our list.

[mjfrombuffalo[$]]

No suggestions on the countertops, but when you're done with his kitchen, would you like to date a nice woman in Long Island?

( Wouldnt' Deb be great as a remodeling project designer/manager?)

[phoenixx[$]]

Wait, I thought you JUST ended this relationship?? And it didn't go easy?? Why are you buying him counters?


/confused...

[theworm[$]]

Where have you been, Leslie.
This is the new and better man!

[conradd]

LOL, yes. Short story is that after swearing off all romance for 2008, I went to a New Years Eve party, met him, and I'm keeping this one. Wonderful man.

Brian, I don't think weight would be a problem since we'd go with copper sheeting over marine plywood. That would cut down on cost too since we're only doing one 12 foot section of countertop (3 feet of which is the sink),and once the patina set in, we wouldn't have to worry about bright orange (although with 2 degrees from OSU, this isn't a serious problem for this Beaver Believer). And, if we ever do get tired of it, we can recycle it and put in something else. Here's a pic from Lynn's link (thanks!) that shows a countertop with patina:



Another option is bronze or pewter, I guess. I like the idea of metal countertops since he's a metalsmith, and a few dents or scratches are fine - just adds to the character.

The reason I thought of copper is because we've decided on a Bluestar range and he wants it in cobalt blue. Blue and orange are opposite on the color wheel, so it will be effective, and we can accent in copper. I think that aged copper would be really effective next to the blue - the kitchen is open to the the living area, so it needs to look good and the dishwasher and refrigerator/freezer are both commercial grade. I'll take your comments back to him though - good thoughts and I appreciate them.

[conradd]

The engineered quartz is beautiful. This is another option I hadn't heard of until Brian mentioned it - thanks.

And Leslie - I'm not buying the countertops, just picking them out. He's paying for everything. It's a beautiful house and if I'd designed it, it would have been markedly similar. He bought a mountain, blew off the top with dynamite, and built a house on solid rock. Right across the road from the Coos River - we can stand on the deck and watch a family of beavers swim by and river otters slide down a mud bank. Salmon and steelhead in the winter and because the river is tidal, it turns to saltwater in the summer and we'll fish for flounder off his fishing dock. We feed a doe and her twin fawns - she was mauled last year by a cougar, so they stick close to the house where they know it's safe. And, there are 2 guest bedrooms, so if anyone is ever in Oregon, I hope you'll stop by once the house is completed. I'll be spending considerable time there.

[magenta321]

I now remember why I'm having such a visceral reaction to a copper kitchen. I had one for the first ten years of my life.

The counter tops were some kind of whitish "plastic" with black and copper flecks in them. The backsplash was copper tiles. The appliances were dark brown. The floor was the same Armstrong floor that is in every ranch house built in the 1960s and 1970s -- reddish "tiles" with greenish grout (yes, they still sell this floor, I have seen it in a catelogue recently). The whole kitchen, even as a very young child, made me want to because it was so dated. I think the house was built in 1968 or so.

The kitchen has been remodelled 2x since 1988 (the last time I saw the kitchen so ugly). I think that is why I don't like the idea of copper counter tops, personally. Plus, patina would always remind me of dirt. I think the regular granite or the engineered quartz you are looking at above are nicer. But, I don't have to live with his kitchen, so it doesn't really matter what I think

I think when I get the money, I might look into the engineered quartz myself. I need new cabinets too though, mine are 1980s... oak. I wish I could gut my kitchen and bathroom!!! Maybe I can tile the floors and the walls of the bathroom in that engineered quartz stuff eventually! :o That would be amazing!

[brian_igo]

conradd said

Right across the road from the Coos River...

Oh my God - you're down in my old neighborhood!

[conradd]

brian_igo said

Oh my God - you're down in my old neighborhood!

Hey, where did you live? I'm hoping to move down here sometime in the next year. I love the south coast and we're far enough inland that it's not as windy as the bay front.

[brian_igo]

I lived in Coos Bay/North Bend for a few years at the end of high school. I don't know how far up the river you are from the bay, but I remember that area well.

The south coast is beyond gorgeous. I really liked it there but the economy in the area was so bad in the early 80's.

Getting back to the counters...using sheet over wood will save you a lot of money. But have you considered using MDF instead of plywood? I ask because plywood would be a lot thinner than people are used to seeing in a counter top. If you go to a local counter maker who makes Formica tops, I'm sure they'd be glad to sell you a MDF top with the edging and backsplash you want, and cut to the size you need.

[Magick1]

I cannot offer any suggestions. I know when I redid our kitchen last year, we went with LG HighMac countertops and absolutely love them.

They are an acrylic, but they are high quality, can have the look of granite, and are seemless with the backsplash.

[conradd]

Update - after reading Brian's post to Ted, we've decided on soapstone countertops - great suggestion! They'll be a dark grey, and that should look good with everything. The lower cabinets are going in as they get built (handmade myrtlewood - they will develop a wonderful golden patina given time) and the dishwasher is hooked up and working, thank God. The range arrived in Portland today and Shane will bring it down after his final exams in June. It has to be in place before the propane tank can be installed, so we'll still be cooking on the grill for a few weeks, but I don't care. It's like the most luxurious camping trip I've ever been on.

I finally found my camera and took a picture of the kitchen in progress and will post it as soon as I can find the card reader.

Next projects will be the boat dock and the garden. It's going to be fun.

[theworm[$]]

sounds amazing! Can't wait to see the pics!

[brian_igo]

Wow - you're using myrtlewood for the cabinets? That is going to be a trick but it will be gorgeous when its done.

(For those who haven't spent time in Southwestern Oregon or Israel...here's what myrtlewood looks like...





I think the soapstone is a great choice with that wood. It will look terrific.