EA Book Club, July Selection (finally!)

*emeleel* · #1 06-21-2004, 06:29 PM

Er - I feel a little guilty about posting a selection for the next book when I haven't even finished the last book.

But here goes. Kindly keep your guffaws, sighs, rolleyes and middle fingers on your side of the computer screens, thankyouverymuch!

(We did agree it didn't have to be strictly upper-crust literary masterpieces, after all...)

Phantom of the Opera, by Gaston Leroux

I know, I know. I think the general consensus among critics is that it's really not much of a book. But it's been hanging on in popularity for decades now. What makes the phenomenon tick? Why so many movies, musicals, "loosely based on" books/plays/movies, etc.?

Up for discussion:

~ Is this, or is this not, a "good book"? Why?
~ If it's no good, why do people love it so much? (Negative points for answering "Because humans are classless idiots who wouldn't know good literature if it bit them on the nose".

~ Are the characters believeable?
~ What's right with the book? What's wrong with the book?
~ Is Christine a powerful character in her own right, or simply a piece of property, a tool, if you will, caught between two men?
~ Is the "love" in the book real (albeit wrongly thrust upon Christine), or a thinly veneered attempt at out and out overpowerment and rape, a way of the Phantom striking out at a world that's done him wrong and denied him?

And, of course, anything else that pops into minds.

Enjoy!

**theworm**[$] · #2 06-21-2004, 11:45 PM

Cool! You even give us discussion questions in advance! Thanks!!!

**lynnzop**[$] · #3 06-22-2004, 12:39 AM

Ooh, Ooh!! I just went to the library tonite and thought "DAMN. I don't have next month's selection to check out!" Now I do (after I finish the yummy WP Kinsella that I picked up

it's baseball season, after all....)

Thanks Melanie...this one should be interesting....

murasaki · #4 06-22-2004, 08:47 AM

I have read this before so I don't think I'll panic if I can't locate a copy around here (I haven't yet gotten a card at the public library because I usually rely on the university library but they tend to have a limited selection of fiction). Good pick!

*emeleel* · #5 06-22-2004, 10:01 AM

Oh yeah - no cheating if y'all can't find the book by looking for the book from the musical that contains all the lyrics and basic staging!

Did y'all know that the ALW musical is coming to the screen in December? !sigh

**soxfan**[$] · #6 06-23-2004, 03:07 PM

Thanks, Melanie! Time for another visit to the library.

Redlass · #7 06-25-2004, 11:55 AM

Wonderful! I'm looking forward to reading the original. A few years ago, I read a haunting book called Phantom that was a retelling of the story and it was fantastic.

*emeleel* · #8 06-25-2004, 02:47 PM

Oh, yes! I was going to recommend that one later, to anyone who ends up liking the real book.

For those who don't know, "Phantom" by Susan Kay is a re-working of the story, but this time with all of Erik's backstory filled in - his birth, his life, how he comes to work on the Opera House, falling in love with Christine, etc. It's a lovely work that stays true to the spirit of the original.

I do NOT, however, recommend the travesty of a book called "The Phantom of Manhatten" by Frederick Forsythe, which purports to pick up the story years later after Erik has moved to Manhatten.

It's horrible. I'm glad I found it at the dollar store!

**lynnzop**[$] · #9 06-30-2004, 01:40 PM

Reserved at the library...who of thunk if was checked out! I won't get until mid-July...how long is this one??

*emeleel* · #10 06-30-2004, 01:47 PM

Not long - and it's a fairly easy read.

Wonder if it would be available at Bibliomania or Project Gutenberg? It's pretty old. Lemme see...

*emeleel* · #11 06-30-2004, 01:49 PM

http://onlinebooks.library.upenn.edu...ux&amode=words

There ya go - 2 HTML versions, one text version!

arianej · #12 06-30-2004, 04:14 PM

Quote:

emeleel said

http://onlinebooks.library.upenn.edu...ux&amode=words

There ya go - 2 HTML versions, one text version!

Cool. I keep forgetting to go to the library, and this will make reading a lot more convenient. Thanks!

Ariane

Redlass · #13 07-16-2004, 11:22 AM

I'm about to head out of town, but I finished reading this yesterday.

A couple of observations:

It was fascinating to see how the original was written and how it has morphed through the years. Anytime you change mediums (such as from a book to a movie or to a stage), you have to make choices and changes. I was fascinated by the changes that were made.

For instance, the Persian played a pretty big role in the book. He didn't show up at all in the musical version. The book had Christine making a choice not just for Raoul's life, but for hers and the Opera Ghost's as well. In the musical version, there is actually a performance of Don Juan.

I did hear the Phantom Music constantly going through my head!

It was definitely written in a style common to the time. Sometimes the detail became a bit much--but despite the detail, I still don't have a good mental image of what the Opera House looks like.

I liked the device chosen--one that makes it seem as though the story is real and the result of an investigative reporting job. It sometimes makes the story a little jumpy, but it also makes it more credible and interesting.

ms_n · #14 07-16-2004, 01:09 PM

Ack! I'm still not done. But, I'm enjoying it.

Side note:

My daugher just finished reading Farenheit 451 this morning. We had an interesting discussion. Then, went to wake up my other daughter for her last day of summer school (the others finished yesterday). I wedged into her bed next to her warm body and asked, "So, what did you think of Farenheit 451?"
She said calmly, sweetly, with a slight croak in her voice, "I think the character Montague (sp?)...didn't get enough sleep."

I am going to read that book and discuss it again with them.

Redlass · #15 07-16-2004, 01:23 PM

Sounds very sweet! Isn't it great when you discuss books with your kids?

ms_n · #16 07-16-2004, 01:35 PM

Yes.

Looking forward to participating in the discussion here.

ms_n · #17 07-18-2004, 11:30 PM

Quote:

emeleel said

~ Is this, or is this not, a "good book"? Why?
~ If it's no good, why do people love it so much? (Negative points for answering "Because humans are classless idiots who wouldn't know good literature if it bit them on the nose".

~ Are the characters believeable?
~ What's right with the book? What's wrong with the book?
~ Is Christine a powerful character in her own right, or simply a piece of property, a tool, if you will, caught between two men?
~ Is the "love" in the book real (albeit wrongly thrust upon Christine), or a thinly veneered attempt at out and out overpowerment and rape, a way of the Phantom striking out at a world that's done him wrong and denied him?

OK. I finished.

First of all, I'd like to thank you for the recommendation. I think I would like to read it again. I am also looking forward to the other selections to come.

I really enjoyed this book overall. However, I felt the story was not complete and some parts were not well told -- particularly the tragedy of the OG's life which subsequently robbed me of the depth of anguish and sorrow I wanted to feel for the him. (Perhaps Susan Kay's work is successful in filling this aspect). Yet, as Redlass said, the way it was told lent to the feeling that it was a product of investigative reporting, and I found myself falling into the possible reality of such a fantastic story.

I'm a sucker for romance, and so I venture to say that it was "love" that allowed the ghost to possess and then release the one thing he wanted most in the world. His genius was driven by many things, but love won out. Christine in all her fairness was not property but an element of mercy and kindness. Her compassion and tears freed the monster from the rejection he had known all his life, and he knew love in those few moments he shared with her.

Oh, no. I think this one is a slow kill for me. I'm going to be bawling in a few minutes here.

**soxfan**[$] · #18 07-23-2004, 12:26 PM

Finished this the other day. I think that the story, since it's sooooo dramatic (maybe I just read a particularly overwrought translation, too), might play out better on stage than it does in print. I also thought that having the Persian tell much of the climax after the fact, rather than letting us see the action as it unfolded, made things less suspenseful than they could've been.

I did think the book made its themes crystal-clear, and I enjoyed the backstage details, though like Bridgette I wished there were more of them.

**lynnzop**[$] · #19 07-24-2004, 11:03 AM

Finished last night. Good news, bad news review.

Loved the story concept. I was only vaguely familiar with it, having never seen Phantom (the play) or any of the movies, save Phantom of the Paradise, years ago and I remember very little of it.) The historical aspect, the Opera House, I'd love to go see it from the descriptions in the book. It sounds phenomenal, and I think Leroux did a fantastic job of painting those pictures.

However. I wish I could read French to know if it is a translation issue or just bad writing....but the characters never seemed to develop at all. There were sections that seemed to be missing chunks. I felt all along like I was reading a teen novel. Maybe reading another version from another translator would answer that question.

What was your take on Erik? Monster, madman, or misunderstood? I felt badly for him when he said that his mother could not stand the sight of him...she gave him his first tiny mask. I had always thought that his disfigurement was a result of an accident (remember, I have only seen the one version of Phantom, in which the ghost's face is destroyed in a vinyl record press), but it sounded more like a birth defect.

**soxfan**[$] · #20 07-26-2004, 05:12 PM

Quote:

Monster, madman, or misunderstood?

Erik was probably stuck in a vicious cycle. Being misunderstood made him mad, which made him act like a monster, which made him even more misunderstood, etc.

**lynnzop**[$] · #21 07-26-2004, 05:23 PM

I've been thinking a lot about Melanie's question:

Quote:

Is this, or is this not, a "good book"? Why?
~ If it's no good, why do people love it so much?

No, I think as written, it's not a "good" book. Again, maybe the translation, but there was just no "development" of story, characters, nothing, IMO. The only thing that seemed rich in development were the descriptions of the theatre itself.

But the concept...the potential that the story has, is immense. I think that's why it's been the base for so many films, musicals, etc.,

To quote something MNM might say:

Ghosts....madmen.....angelic singers....trapdoors....rooms filled with mirrors.....

There's a lot there to work with.