Church of Body Modification?

realtraveller · #1 04-20-2005, 12:42 PM

http://apnews.myway.com//article/200...D89J3TF80.html

A woman who was fired from Costco for having an eyebrow pierce is suing. Of course!

Her claim is that she is a member of the Church of Body Modification and therefore firing her for having an eyebrow pierce is religious discrimination.

I'm thinking of starting the Church of the Holy Highly Paid Slacker. I could do nothing but demand to be highly paid for it or it's religious discrimination.

**theworm**[$] · #2 04-20-2005, 12:49 PM

About the "church"

Quote:

Is the Church real?
Yes. The Church of Body Modification has completed all the steps to be a legally recognized Church in the United States (Church of Body Modification has federal recognition). We are currently awaiting nonprofit status from the Internal Revenue Service. The American Chapter of the Church is working with other groups that are forming around the world to become legally recognized in every country as the Church of Body Modification.

Does the Church believe that body modification is essential to spiritual health?
It is our belief that body modification is one of the safest and most societal responsible ways to stay spiritually healthy and whole. We accept the possibility that there are other means to this end, but for us, this is our chosen method.

Will becoming a member in the Church of Body Modification save me from being fired from my job for visual modification?
In the United States different states have different rights to release an employee for any reason ("right to work"). If it is apparent that the reason you are being released from your workplace is because of your modifications this would be considered a violation of your rights and you have a solid case against the employer... if you can prove that visual body modification the reason you are being released, YES you are protected in the United States.

If I need to take any legal action against discrimination will the Church support me?
The Church of Body Modification will do everything in its power to support your decision, but unfortunately in our infancy we can not afford to send legal action to you. We hope the in future ventures have the funds to support any legal proceedings that those of our fellow modified congregation.

I just got fired for a piercing, if I join, can you help me get my job back or sue my employer?
NO. This is not a scam. You can't join just to protect your job - if you don't believe in the spiritual aspect we can not ethically offer you protection under the Church.

Whatever.

mnehr · #3 04-20-2005, 12:57 PM

Sounds like the church was started as a way to sue employers for wrongful termination.

**drmomentum**[$] · #4 04-20-2005, 01:17 PM

Since I'm irreligious, I guess I have to ask this.

I'm assuming we all say we have respect for other people's beliefs (although I would describe my position more as having respect for everyone's right to their beliefs).

When is it OK to make fun of soemone else's church. I just want ot get the rules down. Is it a length of time thing? (i.e. it's better to make fun of the Mormons than Lutherans?) the A number of adherents? (Better to make fun of Jews than Catholics?) How strong their belief system is? (Better to make fun of agnostics than extreme Christian rightists... or vice versa)

I'm not saying people here are getting in line to make fun of one church or another. I'm just seeing how people decide who gets their respect and who does not.

Perhaps it's a sincerity thing? Maybe people will feel that this church is a scam, or that it will have adherents who are not sincere?

But should my opinion that "church X is a scam" or "Fred doesn't seem to be much of an X" lead to snide comments? Different people have different definitions of "scam" as well.

I have to admit, I have picked on other people's belief systems. To be perfectly honest, I have not always been very tolerant. I'm specifically talking about groups like the "Church of Scientology" and other what might be considered fringe groups.

However, while I think very highly of people I know who are in various religions, I'm not sure I can say I respect the religions themselves. In other words, I think that people are deserving of my respect, but not necessarily organizations with which I disagree.

Thanks for lettimg me ramble on this.

-JP

**theworm**[$] · #5 04-20-2005, 01:22 PM

Good question, JP. I guess the answer is a question - what defines a religion? Many non-religious people - or people who are not affiliated with any sort of organized religion - are extremely spiritual? So - how do we define religion and what constitutes a "church"? I personally feel a spititual bond with trees. I think that trees are powerful. So, if I find some other people who share my spiritual love of trees, and declare myself as a member of the Church of Arbor - is that a "church". I don't know.
I don't think people are so much making fun of this religion (body modification - not trees). While I'm not into tatoos and piercing, I understand that it has a great significance to some of the people who have tatoos and piercing. I'm questioning what makes a religion a religion, and what makes a church, a church. I don't know the answers.

**drmomentum**[$] · #6 04-20-2005, 01:25 PM

Quote:

mnehr said

Sounds like the church was started as a way to sue employers for wrongful termination.

There's yet another angle. "How a church was started."

ALthough, often we're gettign informaiton about how a church was started years, centuries or millenia later and it's the adherents who are telling the story. Often, these descriptions are supernatural (i.e. difficult to believe by everyday standards).

What if the Church of Body Modification adherents said that the idea for the church came to them in a vision, which included some soothing words about them not having to be persecuted anymore. We could throw a holy book in for good measure (although we probably ought not let anyone see the original because probing its origins would be insulting and heretical).

Years later perhaps thousands of sincere believers feel they are part of something larger than themselves.

Sounds like bunk?

-JP

**drmomentum**[$] · #7 04-20-2005, 01:27 PM

No, I don't think there is much here to make fun of. It's more of a respect thing.

As I said, I think people deserve my respect. But does this religion deserve my respect? Does any religion deserve my respect? How do I decide?

-JP

eplovejoy · #8 04-20-2005, 01:29 PM

Quote:

realtraveller said

I'm thinking of starting the Church of the Holy Highly Paid Slacker. I could do nothing but demand to be highly paid for it or it's religious discrimination.

Darn it. I meant to do that but never got around to it. My penance is being a lowly paid slacker.

As for what constitutes a church, I think it can be anything anyone says it is. We have the right to judge only if they ask for the rest of us to be involved by asking for tax exemptions or something.

But of course we can make fun without having to be part of it. Take it out of religion for a minute and that right becomes clear. I don't have to be a Republican to try to find humor in the GOP's latest nonsense. And if we had to be part of something to mock it, only two people could have ridiculed the Lisa Marie Presley/Michael Jackson marriage.

realtraveller · #9 04-20-2005, 01:38 PM

Remember that woman in Florida who was fired for eating a pork sandwich in her Muslim employer's lunchroom? Now, if she'd just had the foresight to establish the Church of the Divine Pork Sandwich and put up some religious tenets on a website stating that she had to eat pork at noon everyday, she'd have kept her job.

It seems to me that the government cannot be in the business of giving their blessing (pardon the pun) to some 'religions' and not others. That would violate the establishment clause. i.e. We, the U. S. will recognize and protect the religious beliefs of Protestants, Catholics, Hindus, Jews, Muslims and Buddhists but not those of the Church of Body Modification.

The issue as it pertains to employment is the government telling employers how to run their businesses. If Costco has a rule that no employee may be pierced then no employee should be pierced if they want to work at Costco.

[Wasn't it the consensus that those pharmacists in Illinois with religious objections to dispensing the morning after pill should give up their profession or move?]

If this lawsuit prevails then those employees who are members of the Church of Body Modification could keep their jobs and others who just like piercing but have no religious reasons to do are fired. Yeah, that's fair.

mnehr · #10 04-20-2005, 01:54 PM

IMHO, Everything is free game to make fun of.. Hell, I make fun of W sometimes and y'all know I'm probably his biggest supporter here (with Jeff a close second..)

**jgibson2**[$] · #11 04-20-2005, 02:11 PM

The Church of Body Modification has a web site.

You can join on-line.

I'm going to stop before I say something uncharitable.

eplovejoy · #12 04-21-2005, 03:40 PM

If the Church of Body Modification puts a metal detector at the door, do you get in only if your piercings set it off?

mtbat · #13 04-21-2005, 09:24 PM

I was showing this to a coworker and an article I read stated that she had joined the church BEFORE she was fired. So at what point does someone religious belifes become too important or too ridiculose?

**mjfrombuffalo**[$] · #14 04-21-2005, 11:34 PM

Shoot, I know people who don't believe in a lot of the stuff that's part and parcel of the church to which they "belong." So if someone cites "it's against my religion," do we then question them on exactly how much they really believe "their" religion?

**amykhar** · #15 04-21-2005, 11:59 PM

Here's another thought. What constitutes a religion? If I look at dictionary.com, there are some definitions I would expect to see:

http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=religion

But, #4 makes me think:

Quote:

A cause, principle, or activity pursued with zeal or conscientious devotion.

How on earth do we legislate that? I mean, for some people, web surfing could fit #4 and you could sue if you were fired for surfing at work.

mtbat · #16 04-22-2005, 12:19 AM

The Church of EA has a nice ring to it Amy.

**amykhar** · #17 04-22-2005, 12:27 AM

Quote:

mtbat said

The Church of EA has a nice ring to it Amy.

I can just imagine how we would elect a pope.

**jgibson2**[$] · #18 04-22-2005, 12:48 AM

Quote:

amykhar said

I can just imagine how we would elect a pope.

We all have to get together, of course!

wivabef · #19 04-22-2005, 02:37 AM

I'm sorry. I've seen some of the people who work at Costco around here. I'll gladly take Church of Body Modification over the Church of the Butt Crack, anyday.

I don't think this woman should have been fired in the first place. Wake up, Springfield! I don't get why people have problems with body piercings and tattoos. Who really gives a rat's ass? They allow beehive hair and comb overs but no eyebrow piercings?

**jgibson2**[$] · #20 04-22-2005, 11:32 AM

Quote:

wivabef said

I'm sorry. I've seen some of the people who work at Costco around here. I'll gladly take Church of Body Modification over the Church of the Butt Crack, anyday.

I don't think this woman should have been fired in the first place. Wake up, Springfield! I don't get why people have problems with body piercings and tattoos. Who really gives a rat's ass? They allow beehive hair and comb overs but no eyebrow piercings?

It would be different at a place like IBM where they used to tell employees that their choice of outfits (no kidding, my sister works there) didn't quite meet the corporate image. I don't think they do that to the same extent any more. But Costco? Really.

**drmomentum**[$] · #21 04-22-2005, 04:15 PM

Quote:

mjfrombuffalo said

Shoot, I know people who don't believe in a lot of the stuff that's part and parcel of the church to which they "belong." So if someone cites "it's against my religion," do we then question them on exactly how much they really believe "their" religion?

Yes, apparently.

And atheists should be taken to task for listening to gospel music, too.

**mtomm**[$] · #22 04-22-2005, 04:33 PM

Quote:

drmomentum said

There's yet another angle. "How a church was started."

ALthough, often we're gettign informaiton about how a church was started years, centuries or millenia later and it's the adherents who are telling the story. Often, these descriptions are supernatural (i.e. difficult to believe by everyday standards).

What if the Church of Body Modification adherents said that the idea for the church came to them in a vision, which included some soothing words about them not having to be persecuted anymore. We could throw a holy book in for good measure (although we probably ought not let anyone see the original because probing its origins would be insulting and heretical).

Years later perhaps thousands of sincere believers feel they are part of something larger than themselves.

Sounds like bunk?

-JP

Ahem, I resemble that remark.