I think my Palm Z22 is dead. I dropped it in my coffee yesterday and despite the hairdryer/rice methods of drying it out, it's unresponsive. I may try to send it to Palm to fix (for $75), but submersion in liquid is one of the things they say is likely unrepairable. A new one costs $200+, which makes me think maybe it's time to upgrade, especially since a stand-alone PDA would cost nearly as much as a smartphone.

And that's where I'm stuck. The choices are so overwhelming and I've got some limitations, not the least of which I'm cheap, and I need some help figuring out what to do or get. Here's my limits:

1) I rely on Franklin Covey PlanPlus for Windows (tech details here). I don't want to upgrade to their on-line version because I'd rather keep the data local, not online, plus I don't want to spend $$ on new planning software. Franklin Covey software was originally developed exclusively with Palm, which might mean better outcomes with Palm software than with Windows software.

2) When it comes to smartphones, I'm pretty limited for cell coverage. Despite what maps show, when asked the cell companies have told me I'm not rated for indoor coverage at home (I'm pretty much surrounded by water and my unit's location in this concrete building limits connectivity). My TMobile plan uses HotSpot At Home, meaning I get indoor connectivity only via my computer's wireless router. TMobile offers the best plan financially for us (family plan w/HotSpot At Home) and the contract isn't up for months yet. I can't tell if any of the smartphones TMobile offers also work with HotSpot At Home, or if the unlocked Palm smartphones work with TMobile HotSpot At Home. Currently Hubby and I pay less than $100/month for a family plan w/HotSpot.

I don't care if I carry a PDA and a cell phone - they don't have to be one item (even though my tech friends make fun of me).

I don't care if my PDA synchs with Outlook - I don't use Outlook at home and I don't want to synch my personal PDA stuff with my work OUtlook account anyway (couldn't figure out a way to keep my personal stuff from being copied to my work Outlook account before, and I don't need my work account to show when I have gyno appointments, for example ).

I don't care if I can't surf the Internet from my phone or PDA.

I don't care if I can't get work or home email from my phone or PDA; it would be nice, but I don't want to spend a lot of money on it every month and it's definitely not essential.

So........suggestions?

Absolutely no advice, but I had to laugh when I saw your title - we *just* (like 5 minutes ago) finished watching the new ST movie! LOL

I don't get the reference, or know what a ST movie is, nor do I have really good advice

I just know when I bought my last one I didn't think I wanted an iphone. I thought they were over-priced gadgets, and that other phones could do all the same things just as well. I also thought Verizon was the only company that gave good reception, based on previous phones I had with other carriers, and remembering my friends' cell troubles from a few years earlier.

But I did my due diligence with Vzn, Tmobile, and AT&T. I asked each one what would happen if I got home and was unhappy with the coverage area. All said I had a period of time to cancel my contract with no penalty. I told them what I wanted in a phone, and they showed me my offerings. I asked them what I could do to save money with them.

Really, I wanted the iphone. But the price ($200) and the fact that I'd need a data plan (pushing my phone bill to $100/month, I think) was too much. I was going to settle on a Tmobile Google phone (I forgot its name) but really, I didn't like the phone as much as the iphone. It seemed like a cheesy impression of the real thing, and felt like it would break easily. Then AT&T told me about the monthly discount that I would get if I was on Kevin's plan. His job gets a big discount, so both of our phones are $100 a month TOTAL. This worked out much cheaper than the other plans for us.

Of course your mileage may vary, but, I suggest you try all the companies in the area and find out if what I was told (you can return the phone/cxl the plan within x days) is still true. I think the coverage problems of the past may just be an annoying memory these days. Kevin and I have traveled most of the state this year together (including a lot of very rural towns), to NYC, and down the east coast to Virginia. We haven't hit one spot where we didn't get coverage. I have one place on 84 in Danbury near the mall that I lose coverage for a moment, but I think it's a matter of crossing the NY/CT cellular border more than anything else.

Margaret: Star Trek. (come out come out whereever you are....)

I have no advice, but I want to know how you dropped it in your coffee.

The new Droid only works with Verizon. The iPhone only works with AT&T.

I'm terribly biased against T-Mobile.

I bought a Palm Pilot a year ago for $80. It does not go on the internet or anything fancy, though I do sync it with my outlook at home (not at work). I bought the cheapest, stripped down model they had at Best Buy since my Tungsten had died and I just needed something to get me through last year and my deployment this year (I plan to upgrade to a Droid when I return to the US next summer).

Re: coverage - it comes down to getting service in my home. I live down by the water, no companies have put cell phone towers in the canal or bay yet :laugh: and my unit faces east, in a way that doesn't get satellite. (People in my area of the building can't get satellite TV either.) The only way I've been able to get coverage in my unit that didn't involve me hanging off the balcony with an arm facing north is via VoIP-enabled service, where my router becomes my cell tower and I go through my Internet connection to make the call. Everywhere else is fine, but I have to have cell service in my home.

Re: dropping the Palm in the coffee. I drink iced coffee and yesterday I was drinking it out of a wide-mouthed tumbler. In moving my coffee and Palm to another room along with other stuff in my other hand, I had placed the Palm flat on the tumbler (which I do with my narrow-mouthed Tupperware tumblers all the time); it slipped and went bottom-first into about 1" of coffee, but the bottom is where all the buttons are and the case I had on it wasn't sufficient to keep the coffee out.

---

(11-26-2009 12:11 PM)murasaki Wrote:  I bought a Palm Pilot a year ago for $80. It does not go on the internet or anything fancy, though I do sync it with my outlook at home (not at work). I bought the cheapest, stripped down model they had...

Which model was it? I thought my Z22 was pretty bottom-of-the-line (and yet totally sufficient for what I wanted to do) but paying $249 for a new one makes the Scotswoman in me shudder.

Can you buy a refurb of whatever you want?

I have an old palm something (not at home, don't know what) that you're that you're welcome to for free. It worked just fine last time I had it out, but Bob gave me an Ipod touch for my birthday and I don't need the palm any more. There's an ap for everything I ever did with the palm. I'll find it when I get home tomorrow and let you know what it is so you can check to see if it will do what you need.

(11-26-2009 12:03 PM)lynnzop Wrote:  Margaret: Star Trek. (come out come out whereever you are....)

Oh. If you saw my comment on FB where I quoted Kevin talking about my attention span and things I don't like... I think it was about the show "V," but it really could be extended to any sci-fi He's right, he can turn it on in a room I'm in, and somehow I can manage to do everything but watch it.

@magenta321

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qJQwHwP0ojI

The "He's Dead Jim" line has infiltrated the common vernacular pretty well in the past 40 years

How funny! I have a Z22. I had to peel the stickers off the back to find the model number.

DAMN, where did you find it for $80? When I looked quick this morning even refurbs were $114.

Since you don't want a data plan and you don't care if you carry two items, how about an iPod Touch? It would give you pretty good bang for your buck. Especially if you get it today or tomorrow:

http://www.onsale.com/p/Apple-MP3-Player...dp.fahdecg

If you go with an 8GB iPod Touch, you don't need to worry about 2nd Gen vs 3rd Gen. The hardware isn't much different.

The things the touch will offer you - email, calendar, tons of apps, your music, podcasts, audio books, videos, etc. You can also surf the web with it via wifi.

No monthly data plans, and tons and tons of free and low-cost applications.

Amy

I love my Ipod touch.

I don't think it works with Franklin Covey software though - FC works with Palm and Windows OS.

(11-26-2009 01:11 PM)mjfrombuffalo Wrote:  The "He's Dead Jim" line has infiltrated the common vernacular pretty well in the past 40 years

Probably true, but like anything else, when you don't know where the quote is from, it zooms right past you. I don't know where the line "which way did he go George, which way did he go?" came from (unless it was Of Mice and Men -- which, I did read the book, even if it was 20 years ago), but I never think to question anyone who says it.

What does Franklin Covey do that no other app can do?

---

Wouldn't this work?

http://www.theiphoneblog.com/2009/04/14/...klincovey/

Franklin Covey is a whole package that follows the Seven Habits of Highly Effective People, which includes goals and a compass and calendaring, it's not just a prioritized task list. The app you pointed to does a task list, but wouldn't integrate with the desktop Franklin Covey software from what I could see.

(11-26-2009 10:04 AM)mjfrombuffalo Wrote:  So........suggestions?

Not sure there are good choices.

Palm's not making Palm OS devices any more, I guess I'd probably look for a used z22 on ebay, or watch for refurb's to show up somewhere.

There's an iphone app (appigo todo) that claims to sync with outlook (with decent reviews) if you want to try a Touch: http://itunes.apple.com/us/app/todo/id282778557?mt=8,

Blackberry's should be able to sync with outlook, if you can get all your F-C info into outlook might be worth looking at a blackberry.

I'd expect a Windows Mobile phone would sync with Outlook, some of the new Windows Mobile phones from HTC seem to get decent reviews, but even Microsoft enthusiasts admit windows mobile phones seem clunky next to the iphone, or the Pre or Android phones. HP still sells a couple of Windows mobile PDA's (not phones), HP 111 user reviews indicate that it syncs well with outlook, kinda pricy for a device that seems outdated, though.

There is a Franklin covey app for the touch.

(11-27-2009 12:11 AM)nc10 Wrote:  

(11-26-2009 10:04 AM)mjfrombuffalo Wrote:  So........suggestions?

Not sure there are good choices.

Palm's not making Palm OS devices any more, I guess I'd probably look for a used z22 on ebay, or watch for refurb's to show up somewhere.

There's an iphone app (appigo todo) that claims to sync with outlook (with decent reviews) if you want to try a Touch: http://itunes.apple.com/us/app/todo/id282778557?mt=8,

Blackberry's should be able to sync with outlook, if you can get all your F-C info into outlook might be worth looking at a blackberry.

I'd expect a Windows Mobile phone would sync with Outlook, some of the new Windows Mobile phones from HTC seem to get decent reviews, but even Microsoft enthusiasts admit windows mobile phones seem clunky next to the iphone, or the Pre or Android phones. HP still sells a couple of Windows mobile PDA's (not phones), HP 111 user reviews indicate that it syncs well with outlook, kinda pricy for a device that seems outdated, though.

F-C is its own software, I don't use it with Outlook. I could transfer the data to Outlook probably if I was leaving the F-C software entirely, but daily synching between handheld, outlook, and F-C would be a PITA. F-C is supposed to work with Windows Mobile directly though (see the link I posted).

Amy, what's the F-C app for the touch? who makes it? I take it it's not the same one Margaret posted.

MJ:
I know you think I am picking on you, but the reality is that the world is headed in a different direction.

As mentioned, Palm has dumped Palm. In a February interview Palm CEO Ed Colligan said; "There will be no more PalmOS devices released by Palm (excepting the Centro getting released on other carriers). They're focused on webOS (Palm Pre) and Windows Mobile." (http://www.precentral.net/palm-ceo-ed-co...-investors).

Going with Palm will give you a device that has no support and no future. I hate to say it, but I suspect your Franklin Covey PlanPlus is headed in the same direction. Their description of the latest version on the link you give says "This new version offers compatibility with the new Windows Vista". Ummm Yea. That is so old by now that Windows 7 is, well, OK. So, Windows XP support is going away and Vista was garbage, and Windows 7 is doing very well. If they are not even thinking of a Windows 7 version, chances are that they are getting ready to turn it into abandonware. After reading the reviews on Amazon, I can see why. The problem is the whole paradigm has shifted. Their software was automating paper pocket planners. The decision in version 5.1 to stop printing FC type planner pages is because they realized the world has moved passed automating paper and is carrying little internet connected computers in their pockets. That allows you to completely rethink the whole thing. Instead of prioritizing tasks, you give them due dates and times with follow up reminders. You snooze what is in process and mark complete that which should go away. And it is all automated.

The reasons I favor Smartphones are:
1) Mobile companies subsidize the cost of smartphones. They can cost nothing compared to a PDA or a touch.
2) They can synchronize themselves. How useful is it to add something to your calendar when you forget to sync? My phone synchronizes my calendar, contacts, tasks and email with Outlook at my job over the internet instantly. I add an appointment on the PC, it pops up on my phone. My phone then synchronizes those same items wirelessly and automatically via bluetooth the minute I walk in the door at home on my home PC. I NEVER manually sync.
3) When done right, you get integration. My phone automatically goes to vibrate when I mark a meeting busy. If someone emails me an appointment it automatically is in my calendar, If I flag an email for follow up, it becomes a task. I can email addresses to my on phone GPS navigation system, or use one of my contacts as a destination, or call to verbally speak where I want to go. Having a connected device is far more than just being able to surf the web.

As for your issue with mobile hotspot, Sprint offers the same thing now (I hate T-mobile myself now, they really have gone down hill). But, you need to start test driving some stuff. First, get people with different phones and different providers in your apartment. Talk to your neighbors. Different phones have different coverage. I know it is sacrilege, but most people feel that although it is ultra cool and has the best toys, the Iphone sucks as a phone. First think who they were aiming for, the first version had no ability to sync with corporate email, but it could get youtube. Sadly for cheap you, cheaper phones also get worse coverage because they are made, well, cheap. Different carriers are making android phones so their quality varies. BUT, coverage maps mean nothing compared to getting a device in your house. Have a pizza "I wanna check out your phone" party. See who can get calls and find out why.

The Iphone/Itouch FC app is getting terrible reviews BTW, even from those who like the FC system.
http://www.iphoneappreviews.net/2009/03/...klincovey/

Windows mobile phones, may be a little clunky and not as slick, but they are THE BEST WAY to sync to corporate exchange email. And they have some cool apps. Some probably would make you very happy in the calendar and task department. Check out AGENDAONE (only $18.95):

http://www.developerone.com/agendaone/index.htmhttp://www.developerone.com/agendaone/index.htm

You also need to look at Outlook 2007 and its optional Calendar printing module. It can still print planner pages.

Check out:
http://office.microsoft.com/en-us/outloo...11033.aspx

I know change is hard, but check out your options, I think you will like what is out there.
TD

I have an HTC Touch Pro 2 (Windows Mobile phone) and I love it (It's on Verizon, but it's also available on TMo I believe) - because it's a Windows PDA it should run F-C

My friend has the MyTouch (TMo's Google Android phone) and loves it, but it isn't Windows and has no F-C app

Another friend has the DROID Eris (the touch screen only version of the DROID) and loves it, but it is also an Android phone, so it probably won't have F-C

All of my friends who have the iPod Touch love them, and it is not carrier specific as far as I know, and it has an F-C app

All of my friends who have iPhones curse the day they bought them. Serious coverage issues, even beyond your apartment/location

• Smoke Rings, Coffee Stains •• Uptown Uncorked •• Mashable •• Film POP! • • Twitter

So if the HTC Touch works as VoIP on Wi-fi, it could work for me... hmmm.

Meanwhile, I discovered my Palm will synch with the computer, but the screen is black. There's a repair center a couple towns over I might try taking it to this weekend.

---

Thanks, Tom. No need for a party, no one who's come to my house can get cell service unless they do the artistic dance on my patio. HotSpot at home has been a lifesaver for us. I'll have to check Sprint's pricing plan for their version.

As for change, if I *really* had my way, I'd still be using Schedule+, but there's no hand-held to synch with that Outlook does not sufficiently replace FC for me, it doesn't have all the FC features and while I've tried to customize it at work to do the same things, it doesn't do all I want it to do the way I want to do it. FC is more than just calendar and tasks, the roles and goals features are extremely important to me. So it would seem to stick with FC I either have to get a Windows Mobile-based smartphone or switch to FC PlanPlus Online (ick).

And believe it or not, I don't print my planner pages from my FC software (I do for my work calendar though, since I couldn't get it to synch with my Palm without putting the personal stuff in the work calendar.)

(11-27-2009 12:42 AM)mjfrombuffalo Wrote:  F-C is its own software, I don't use it with Outlook. I could transfer the data to Outlook probably if I was leaving the F-C software entirely, but daily synching between handheld, outlook, and F-C would be a PITA. F-C is supposed to work with Windows Mobile directly though (see the link I posted).

My apologies. Wasn't saying it was a good choice, but since the F-C page for your software mentions it syncs with outlook, just saying using outlook to sync with other devices could be an option. I don't see where the F-C software said it sync'd directly with windows mobile, but it makes sense that it would sync with windows mobile.

(I couldn't tell from the F-C website) but I wonder if F-C uses Outlook to sync with windows mobile devices. Windows mobile likes to sync that kind of stuff through outlook. Windows mobile pocket pc's used to always come with a copy of Outlook for that reason. (The last Pocket PC I owned was using win mobile 5 or whatever it was called then. I haven't tried 6 or 6.5. )

When syching with the Palm, the FC software adds its own modules/apps to the Palm and synchs with those directly. I'll have to check if it uses Outlook for WinMobile. Thanks!

(11-27-2009 08:49 AM)mjfrombuffalo Wrote:  When syching with the Palm, the FC software adds its own modules/apps to the Palm and synchs with those directly. I'll have to check if it uses Outlook for WinMobile. Thanks!

http://www.franklinplanner.com/fc/get_or...s#pocketpc

(select handhelds, it says: Does it work with Pocket PC devices?

No, PlanPlus for Windows does not synchronize with Pocket PC devices. For users of Pocket PCs, we recommend using PlanPlus for Microsoft Outlook which contains synchronization for Daily Tasks, Master Tasks, Daily Record, as well as appointments, contacts, and notes.

Pocket PC is kinda an outdated term since smartphones got so popular, but this FAQ makes me suspicious that the version 5 of Planplus won't work with win mobile devices.

PlanPlus for Microsoft Outlook
http://www.franklinplanner.com/fc/get_or...ft_outlook

(Not meaning to derail MJ's thread further, but hey - it's EA. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FlTMXiqbDZU )

Cheapness kicking in. FC PlanPlus Online costs $149.95 per year (subscription service only). Ouch.

Did ya get my PM from yesterday MJ?

Yeah - gotta check things out first, that's why I didn't get back to you yet

ok

(11-27-2009 01:52 AM)tdewar Wrote:  MJ:
I know you think I am picking on you, but the reality is that the world is headed in a different direction.


Windows mobile phones, may be a little clunky and not as slick, but they are THE BEST WAY to sync to corporate exchange email.
You also need to look at Outlook 2007 and its optional Calendar printing module. It can still print planner pages.

I know change is hard, but check out your options, I think you will like what is out there.
TD

It may be hard to believe, but I agree with most of this. My Windoze Mobil phone synchs with corporate email, appts and contacts and 3 personal email accounts. And although I don't look for more apps, this is the direction of things in the future. Mine cost $50 a 1+ years ago when theh BlackJack II first went to refurbs on AT&T. Each provider has options for WinMobile. Some of them are FREE. That's cheap, right?

But, more importantly to me, is the issue of security. And right now, the mobile security experts are saying that WinMobile is more secure out of the box. But, opening up ports on any phone with Bluetooth and connecting to unsecured hotspots or WiFi connections will make any phone or device more vulerable to attack.

If you change your mind on the iphone (or if anyone else is looking for a steal on one...)

http://www.fatwallet.com/forums/hot-deals/971030/

I bought two touches yesterday. I am doubting my sanity but I did get good deals on them.

(11-27-2009 09:04 AM)nc10 Wrote:  

(11-27-2009 08:49 AM)mjfrombuffalo Wrote:  When syching with the Palm, the FC software adds its own modules/apps to the Palm and synchs with those directly. I'll have to check if it uses Outlook for WinMobile. Thanks!

http://www.franklinplanner.com/fc/get_or...s#pocketpc

(select handhelds, it says: Does it work with Pocket PC devices?

No, PlanPlus for Windows does not synchronize with Pocket PC devices. For users of Pocket PCs, we recommend using PlanPlus for Microsoft Outlook which contains synchronization for Daily Tasks, Master Tasks, Daily Record, as well as appointments, contacts, and notes.

Pocket PC is kinda an outdated term since smartphones got so popular, but this FAQ makes me suspicious that the version 5 of Planplus won't work with win mobile devices.

PlanPlus for Microsoft Outlook
http://www.franklinplanner.com/fc/get_or...ft_outlook

New piece of the puzzle: Tried with my current Plan Plus for Windows software and it does allow synch with Outlook, but it only brings over appointments, tasks, and contacts. It doesn't bring over the stuff that makes me FC - goals, values, mission statement, compass, and roles. So if I'm reading this situation correctly, I either need to stick with a handheld with Palm OS 4.0 or greater, buy the FC for Outlook and use a handheld with Windows OS (but it's not clear that the FC extras etc will come over with that either), or switch to the online version of FC and get a handheld with Internet. The Scotswoman in me is really distrustful of option 3 - yeah, I can get a cheap smartphone, but I don't want to spend a lot every month on the FC subscription plus the data plan I'd probably need.

I hear ya, I didn't want to pay for the data plan at first either. Now I can't imagine life without it. I'd get rid of cable before I'd get rid of my data plan now.

A big part of that problem is Hubby pays the cell phone bill, and right now it averages $91 for two people on a family plan, him with nothing (he even has texts blocked from his phone) and me with a $5 text package. We never go over on minutes or anything. We pride ourselves in being cheap If I go with online planning, that means every time I look at my task list or my calendar when I'm not home, I'd be on data minutes - and that is a LOT of minutes. That and honestly, I like to OWN software, especially software that contains a lot of personal data. I don't like the idea of cloud-computing that kind of stuff, and paying for a subscription, and then figuring out how to collect the data back when I want to cancel the subscription.

I finally heard back from a local repair place that thinks they can fix the Z22 10 days or so, for $75. I see a Z22 on Ebay for $41, but I've never bought from Ebay and don't know if I want to start now. Otherwise it's $169+ at the stores that still carry them. It seems the cost-effective thing to do is fix it (one time cost and no additional costs going forward, and barring any accidents, I can probably keep it going for another couple years), but techies like my friend tdewar, above, will be disgusted with me

(11-28-2009 02:05 PM)mjfrombuffalo Wrote:  The Scotswoman in me is really distrustful of option 3 - yeah, I can get a cheap smartphone, but I don't want to spend a lot every month on the FC subscription plus the data plan I'd probably need.

I don't even like to use the expression "cheap smartphone". I tell people my iPhone cost ~$2200 (phone plus the required 2 year contract). Pretty hard to find a smartphone that doesn't come with a required data plan.

Is carrying a netbook around an option, probably a little too big, and a little too slow.....

(11-28-2009 02:05 PM)mjfrombuffalo Wrote:  ...... It doesn't bring over the stuff that makes me Heart FC - goals, values, mission statement, compass, and roles. So if I'm reading this situation correctly, I either need to stick with a handheld with Palm OS 4.0 or greater, buy the FC for Outlook and use a handheld with Windows OS (but it's not clear that the FC extras etc will come over with that either)

According to the F-C website, it sounds like Planplus for outlook brings the stuff you want over to win mobile devices. Sounds like this software, plus an HP iPaq handheld would be close to what you had with the z22, but the software and hand held with cost $400-500........


Does it work with Windows® Mobile devices?

Yes, PlanPlus for Outlook has applications and synchronization for WinMobile devices using OS version 5.0 and 6.0. The following applications are included (with conduits for each):

* Daily Tasks
* Master Tasks
* Daily Notes
* Compass/Roles
* Project
* Mission/Values
* Goals

PlanPlus also synchronizes calendar, contacts, and notes with the Windows® Mobile device.

---

(11-28-2009 02:52 PM)mjfrombuffalo Wrote:  We never go over on minutes or anything. We pride ourselves in being cheap If I go with online planning, that means every time I look at my task list or my calendar when I'm not home, I'd be on data minutes - and that is a LOT of minutes.

AT&T data plans added to a cell phone talk plan adds $30/month. Data is more or less unlimited, and doesn't count against your talk minutes. Some companies offer data plans by the megabyte, but even then I don't believe it counts against your minutes.

---

(11-28-2009 02:52 PM)mjfrombuffalo Wrote:  It seems the cost-effective thing to do is fix it (one time cost and no additional costs going forward, and barring any accidents, I can probably keep it going for another couple years), but techies like my friend tdewar, above, will be disgusted with me

Might want to keep this document handy..
http://www.palm.com/us/support/contact/e...st_Z22.pdf

and this
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vie...0170394200

(just kidding...)

:laugh: Thanks NC. I'm thinking I should buy a battery for it before they're discontinued too. I know progress is good and all, but it seems that so often when technology and software get upgraded, you end up losing some of the abilities you had before when you had things working the way you wanted, like my VCR before the days of digital cable. Heck, I was using Schedule+ right up until 2 years ago when I got the Z22 and finally sprung for the FC software... and while FC has all the features I wanted and wasn't able to jerry-rig into Schedule+, Schedule+ is a more stable product - I've had to repair and reinstall FC a couple times in the past two years for data corruption problems I never had in Schedule+.