Another way to earn a buck writing

[adonna]

Ghosts are haunting the halls of academia, and making money doing it. At least that's what I found while searching around for other ways to make money writing.

Here's the skinny:

There's this business online where college students in a crunch (or with more money than talent, who knows) can put out a call for ghost writers to do their term papers for them. A rush order is $20 per page, well, here's what they say:

Paper Type:

Paper Due in anywhere between 8-23 hours (writer makes: $20 per page)
Paper Due anywhere between 1-2 days (writer makes: $15.00 per page)
Paper Due anywhere between 3-6 days (writer makes: $12.00 per page)
Paper Due in 7 days or later (writer makes: $10.00 per page)

What you do is establish a writer's account with them, then log in, and choose the assignments you want. Then get busy, write it up, upload it, and get your check monthly.

I don't know if I'd do it yet, although I'll admit to writing books as a ghost so that some braindead CEO could look good with a few publications under his belt. I've done a few of those, and of course, I've ghosted briefs many a time (it's a common enough practice for lawyers to have their briefs done by someone else.) But when I was in college, I resisted doing term papers. Now, I dunno. It might just be a kick.

And for some of the people who are distressed because epinions isn't paying like they used to, this would definitely be a way to pick up those extra pennies.

Nostalgic for college life? This might be the perfect sideline for you. I'll leave it to you to decide.

The business is Student Network Resources. Their web site is www.snrinfo.com.

I haven't been there and done that yet, but then, I've got a wave of my own briefs due soon, so may not have the time to devote to this passtime.

[adonna]

Oh. Just checked the site. I note they ask for a resume. Well, they didn't ask me for one. I just sent them a brief note telling them about myself, and that did it. It could for you too.

[hadassahchana[$]]

I'm not sure I understand. Do you mean that these students are paying people to write papers for them? As in, they have the assignment due, but instead of actually doing the work , reading the material and writing it, they are paying people to write and research their term papers?


And, if that's what you mean, then why on earth do they need a resume? It's not like the students who use such a "service" are going to have an stellar career ruined if someone who is writing their papers does a less than brilliant job. I mean, honestly - we are not talking about Future Leaders here- if the students show that little interest in educating themselves, I honestly don't see why it would matter at all who writes the paper.

Cindy

Hey... if these kids learn to delegate and dump their responsibilities on others early, they'd make fine C.E.O.'s and worthless dumbass managers that we all end up working for and wondering where in the f- they came from.

There's absolutely no way I'd write a paper for some student. At Rice, everything was based on the Honor Code. I guess it still follows me to this day... on my honor yadda yadda yackety schmackey, where do I sign?

[magenta321]

Oh I loved the Honor Code. What a joke. I had a professor who made us sign a relese for the final exam, stating "I have neither given, nor received help on this exam, under penalty of a failing grade." Um, I signed mine. The same professor told me at least 2 of the 10 answers Ahhh... VAX was never my thing anyway.

I think I will look into this. I wrote more people's papers than I'd care to admit. And File, it's not just the future CEO's, it's doctors too. I got a friend into PA school with my touching-essay about a made-up grandfather

$20 a page sounds fair. Personally, I would not buy another person's paper. I'd feel dirty about it. However, if someone is lazy enough to have me write their paper, fine. I wish them well.

Margaret (who was once paid $80 for a paper on the movie Grease. Hahahahaaaa, I love taking money from idiots.)

[vania]

Ick. This just all seems a bit unethical to me.

Then again, I was an English major who ADORED writing papers (probably because I always got A's on them, as opposed to written tests), so maybe I'm just not understanding the concept of not wanting to write one of these yourself....

[Redlass]

I haven't gone and looked at the site, so maybe the answer is there, but...

I wonder whether the students still have to do the research. I've often thought that academic journals could be made much more readable if professors hired writers to write up the results of their research. (Maybe not English or writing professors, but everyone else.) I'm less comfortable with students doing this. It's so hard to find people in the business world who can communicate well via writing that I'd like to see students get as much practice as possible.

[kurt_messick]

I wonder if there is any way to write in a code that professors would see.

I'm actually suspicious at times that people are not turning in their own work. When it goes from a barely literate C to a rather insightful A, then there is a problem.

I'd rather just get paid for the A.

[realtraveller]

This is completely unethical in my book. It's like paying someone to take a test for you.

I've seen any number of companies that are seeking writers to provide this "service". I refuse to help a college student cheat.

[hadassahchana[$]]

This is completely unethical in my book. ...I refuse to help a college student cheat.

Cindy

[lynnzop[$]]

Ditto.

If I ever caught my college student doing this, I'd have her heiny in a sling so fast her head would spin.

Not that she would...she's an

Lynn

[AuntieEmma[$]]

I agree with realtraveller and Cindy.

[Redlass]

So, how do you all feel about ghostwriting? Is it any different?

[dearladyb]

I will have to say I ghosted for nearly 10 yrs. I learned I was only selling myself short. Not actually being able to take credit for my work.

I do not think the two compare. I mean come on, we are talking about (for me anyway) if I wrote a paper it would be for a student nurse or doc.. very different than someone already established and needs to boost book sales. I don't see them being the same. But in the same respect either way you are doing a dis-service to only yourself. This person will not learn, you have already learned and researched it.

Another question what happens when two students turn in the same paper to the same class?

Just a thought..... in my humble opinion.

[hypotenuse]

I dunno y'all.

This is all very easy for us to talk about, and disapprove, simply because we would have no trouble writing such a paper. But some people cannot. And it's no reflection on their overall level of intelligence or competency.

Take my cousin. She is two classes shy of her Associates in Childhood Education. Her dream is to work in a daycare. With infants. She is wonderful with children, especially babies, and would be the care giver that most parents dream of having.

Those two classes?

English.

She simply cannot handle the essays. Cannot.

Now, this inability has nothing to do with her skill level with children. Nor her competency in her chosen field. However, it is everything to do with a bunch of red tape.

Now, if she'd let me, I'd write the papers for her. For free. (She's family after all...) But she won't. Her pride won't let her. But she's been those two classes shy of her degree for twenty years now and I think that it's a crying shame as well as a failing in our educational standards.

Lynne

[adonna]

Originally posted by hadassahchana
I mean, honestly - we are not talking about Future Leaders here
Cindy

Snicker.... sorry. I'm thinking of a certain present leader who had a less than stellar academic career, and who obviously benefitted from the services of someone else to do the writing for him. (And still is.) It seems that leaders need teleprompter skills much more than they do those of research and reasoning. That and maybe a little drilling in the pronunciation of polysylabic words when in a public speaking situation.

But that's a major digression, please disregard.

Anyhow, as I said, nobody really wanted my resume. But I suppose they don't want Joe the Butcher writing those term papers.

[adonna]

About ghosting and ethics:

Ghosting--I've done quite a bit of it too. I've no problem with it, especially since it's usually topics I've little interest in, certainly I might have my problems if it were my passion.

But maybe not. I don't see it as doing myself a disservice, any more than it would be doing myself a disservice to write a product review when I "should" be writing poetry. (I've been criticised by f(r)iends because I was writing at epinions, when according to them, I should be using my art for a higher purpose.)

If you look at it another way, too, I'm still ghosting. Ghosting a position, at any rate. As an appellate advocate, I'm always pressing to get my client an advantage. It may not be where my muse would take me, were I to let my muse loose on a brief, but I'm not an appellate justice, just an advocate. An advocate is a ghost in this way.

As for the ethics of writing a paper for the hapless college student who, for one reason or another, is unable to do it for herself, I would say it's a thing that you'd have to judge on a case by case basis. The woman who is brilliant with kids, and not so brilliant with wordsmithing, would it be the same to help her as it would be to help little Georgie six pack, son of the Texas energy millionaire?

Maybe there's too much reliance on this ethic that we all have to be well rounded (in certain proscribed classical ways). What if that ethic extended to home repair? Sure, I could see some of my neighbors rewiring the kitchen in their spare time, but my SO? No, I'd hire a professional before I'd sit back and watch him fry.

If it bothers you, by all means, don't do it. I know writers who won't do anything at all but highly meaningful poetry, or their latest big comment on the Human Condition. I know writers who disdain the mystery writer because she's a hack. There's all kinds, in every endeavor.

My take is, we're writers. If we weren't, we probably wouldn't be here, because we wouldn't have become addicted to epinions. I doubt if the person who just hits epinions to read the occasional review ever gets hooked. No, it's us writers. And some of us are writers who want to make money. Unless somebody in charge has a sincere objection to me posting the occasional place to make money putting words together, I'll do it. This may not be the right gig for you, but somebody out there is going to like that $20 a page. (The guy who owns the site, while pitching the value of doing this to me, mentioned that some of the writers made seven grand last month writing papers. That $7,000 might be just the kind of income share that some writers find worthwhile.)

[AuntieEmma[$]]

I don't have a problem with ghostwriting. Where I think that's different from students buying (i.e. plagiarizing) papers is that the purpose of a student paper is to see what the student has learnt, and how well s/he can research, organize, and express their ideas.

School is about learning. It's not just a place to get or buy a certificate in order to get a job.

I don't see how advocacy is at all analogous. No one thinks that the client has written the brief - there's no deception involved.

As for home repair -- I'm hopeless at it. But if I decided that I wanted to get better and I took a course, and we had to do a project that would count as the class's final exam, what would be the point of hiring a professional to do my class project for me?

By the way, I don't mind if you post these "opportunities" here. It's actually sort of interesting to see what sort of scams are out there. But I hope you don't mind if I express my reaction.

P.S. The reason the paper mills pay the writers so much is because (1) supply and demand -- there aren't tons of writers knocking down their doors because there are a lot of people who don't want to do it (the same reason, btw, that prostitution pays so well) and (2) there's an element of risk, albeit probably only a small one -- I'm pretty sure there have been crackdowns on these companies recently, but most likely the owners, rather than the writers, are the ones getting in the most trouble. Anyway, that's what I think people are getting paid for, not for any special abilities as writers -- so the product review versus poetry analogy also doesn't make much sense to me.

[frazzledspice]

My husband went to college at night. Sometimes he just got really bogged down and I'd help write his English term papers for him.

Once he had to compare a poem by Wordsworth to a poem by Pope.

He liked the Wordsworth poem; I liked the Pope poem.

He wrote the Wordsworth critique; I wrote the Pope critique. He got an A plus. The teacher read the paper aloud in class. He was SO embarrassed.

He did write most of his term papers (I typed them--pre word-processor days.)

I don't think I would want to make money that way, though...although I don't feel bad about helping him here and there when he was working FT as a computer programmer and taking 9 credits a semester.

[hypotenuse]

Originally posted by AuntieEmma


School is about learning. It's not just a place to get or buy a certificate in order to get a job.

Ahh, but that's your interpretation. Some colleges, and I point to many of the local community colleges, are just that. A place to earn a certificate in order to better your job situation.

To be a well rounded plumber, yah, you could read Plato. But it would have absolutely no effect on your earning situation. And it shouldn't.

People go to college for many different reasons. Which is why I find the one size fits all sort of regulation rather presumptuous.

Lynne

[AuntieEmma[$]]

This makes no sense to me. If it's ok for students to buy their papers (and if plumbers and community college students are going to be presumed to be uneducatable!) why not just dispense with all those expensive and time-consuming classes and papers and tests altogether, and just sell the certificates and diplomas that will open employers' doors for the price of the tuition? Why go through the charade of having teachers involved at all?

[adonna]

Originally posted by AuntieEmma
By the way, I don't mind if you post these "opportunities" here. It's actually sort of interesting to see what sort of scams are out there. But I hope you don't mind if I express my reaction.

I don't mind although I find it interesting that you should characterize all of the potential jobs I find out there for writers to be scams. I wonder, are you saying that all persons who seek the services of writers are scamming them, or is there a different inference to be drawn from that comment?

[AuntieEmma[$]]

Originally posted by adonna


I don't mind although I find it interesting that you should characterize all of the potential jobs I find out there for writers to be scams. I wonder, are you saying that all persons who seek the services of writers are scamming them, or is there a different inference to be drawn from that comment?

What I meant was that the company itself, the paper mill, was running a scam, charging students to help them cheat. I didn't mean they were scamming the writers, although come to think of it, I'm not sure how far I would trust someone whose business was based on deception to be good about paying me if I worked for them. Although I did know someone, years ago, who wrote papers for one of these companies, and as I far as I know, he always got paid, so maybe that's a non-issue -- though if you did have a problem, what would your recourse be? If the business is illegal (that's if -- I don't really know), then would you be able to sue them for your fees or would that get you in more trouble than it would be worth?

And while I wasn't saying before "that all persons who seek the services of writers are scamming them," now that you mention it ... I do think it pays to be careful. Aspiring writers are a traditional target group for con artists, just as dieters and people seeking miracle cures for untreatable medical conditions are traditional target groups. Not all people seeking writers are running cons by any means, but in my opinion, enough are that it does pay to try and check people out before doing business with them, if you have no idea who they or their companies are ... and also any time something sounds too good to be true.

Despite all this I am, genuinely, interested in seeing info about potential writing jobs.